Author Topic: Trademark, Copyright etc.  (Read 1369 times)

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guest1523

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Re: Trademark, Copyright etc.
« Reply #15 on: June 21, 2018, 07:48:57 am »
Thanks for explaining :)

So all in all we have the "they-wont-sue-because-they-are-reasonable-defence" and the "small-fish-defence". So if CBS/Paramount changes it's mind today there is going to be trouble.
Coming from a country that handles these issues very seriously (fair use just isn't a thing here, maybe you heard of GEMA and organisations like that and right now the EU is fiddling with content-creation-regulation that is going to produce results not yet foreseeable but which are probably going to be bad) this is concerning to me.

There have been some f*-up, expensive things happening to unsuspecting, regular people here because of stuff they did on the internet with copyrighted material that they didn't have a proper permission etc. for.
It might be all well and good in the US and elsewhere but I think to me it might be a risk. I apologize for not checking this at the start but I think because of the reasons I gave and although I've had a great time with you guys I can no longer be part of the simulations :'( :'(

Offline Solluk

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Re: Trademark, Copyright etc.
« Reply #16 on: June 21, 2018, 09:00:52 am »
My Primary Shadowfleet Character:


Offline James H. Hawk

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Re: Trademark, Copyright etc.
« Reply #17 on: June 21, 2018, 09:46:50 am »
Thanks for explaining :)

So all in all we have the "they-wont-sue-because-they-are-reasonable-defence" and the "small-fish-defence". So if CBS/Paramount changes it's mind today there is going to be trouble.
Coming from a country that handles these issues very seriously (fair use just isn't a thing here, maybe you heard of GEMA and organisations like that and right now the EU is fiddling with content-creation-regulation that is going to produce results not yet foreseeable but which are probably going to be bad) this is concerning to me.

There have been some f*-up, expensive things happening to unsuspecting, regular people here because of stuff they did on the internet with copyrighted material that they didn't have a proper permission etc. for.
It might be all well and good in the US and elsewhere but I think to me it might be a risk. I apologize for not checking this at the start but I think because of the reasons I gave and although I've had a great time with you guys I can no longer be part of the simulations :'( :'(

I mean, you wouldn't be liable for any damages even in the unlikely event they do come after us. If they do, they'd just send a cease and desist notice which we'd have to oblige with (as legally we have no leg to stand on, fan fiction doesnt' really even fall under fair use). There would be no further consequences to us and certainly none for you.


Offline Jada

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Re: Trademark, Copyright etc.
« Reply #18 on: June 21, 2018, 10:07:21 am »
I've never ever heard of any copyright holder trying to stop any fanfic or roleplay group. The closest I've heard of is Disney not wanting Disney images to be used as portraits on RolePlay onLine, but that's it. Stopping roleplay and fanfic just seems absurd. A collection of references in a not-for-profit story isn't a substantial enough lift for copyright infringement. Even wikis that completely retell works seem to function just fine.

The only thing that will summon the lawyers is actual copyright infringement: trying to make money off it or sharing whole illegal copies of novels or episodes or whatever over the site. And that of course isn't happening.

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Offline Alexander Wu

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Re: Trademark, Copyright etc.
« Reply #19 on: June 21, 2018, 10:11:15 am »
I mean, you wouldn't be liable for any damages even in the unlikely event they do come after us. If they do, they'd just send a cease and desist notice which we'd have to oblige with (as legally we have no leg to stand on, fan fiction doesnt' really even fall under fair use). There would be no further consequences to us and certainly none for you.

James is correct, the first step would be a cease and desist, at which point we wouldn't have a choice but to have our curtain call. It would be highly unlikely that we would attract the wrong type of attention in the first place, for the reasons previously listed; we are entirely amateur and the only money raised is in form of donations to pay for our server expenses. To be safe, we also have a disclaimer on our main site page relegating all Star Trek and related trademarks to CBS.

It'd be a shame to have you leave over something trivial and hypothetical, but in the end, the choice is yours.

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Offline Kinley Garrison

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Re: Trademark, Copyright etc.
« Reply #20 on: June 21, 2018, 10:27:58 am »
I agree with everything stated above. we've been going for almost 11 years now. if CBS decided they had a bone to pick with us (which I highly doubt) then they would have probably told us by now. however, I think that CBS has a lot bigger things to worry about than an amateur roleplay site with only a handful of players. If we had an active membership that was registered in the thousands or tens of thousands, where we had a major presence, they might take notice, but I don't think that's likely. we're complete nobodies to them, and that's fine by me (even though I'm pretty sure we could make a story much better than the current stuff they're putting out) (just kidding on that. :P )
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Offline Malcolm Adeyemi

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Re: Trademark, Copyright etc.
« Reply #21 on: June 21, 2018, 10:40:04 am »
Hey Elias,

I have read this thread. You should listen to Alex Wu and I. We've been here longer than anybody. Also, Dylan might be able to chime in, as well as Kirok. They are actively involved in running the website.

Viacom is the world's ninth largest media and entertainment company. They have much bigger worries than 60 weirdos talking about baguettes, pineapple on pizza, and writing amateur Star Trek missions. We are fine.

Trust me, you'll be OK. Stay with us, we like you. :)

guest1523

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Re: Trademark, Copyright etc.
« Reply #22 on: June 21, 2018, 11:46:20 am »
Thanks guys for your reassurance. I appreciate it.  :)
Right now I'm talking to Malcom about this, but in any case I need some time to think and further evaluate it.

Offline Calandra Trilarck

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Re: Trademark, Copyright etc.
« Reply #23 on: June 21, 2018, 12:45:42 pm »
[ I'm pretty sure a site like this would fall under transformative work as we are engaging in an activity that's not offered by the rights holders of Star Trek. Play by post RPGs is such a small, niche corner of the internet, if you typed in Star Trek in Google Search, you'd never find this site. Even if you typed in Star Trek RPG, you'd still have a hard time finding this site. If the rights holders to Star Trek established their own OFFICIAL Star Trek Play by Post RPG and charged for admission - which is well within their right to do - then, the board will be in serious trouble. Axanar got into trouble because Star Trek is primarily a visual medium and it hurt the interests of the franchise.]

Nature of the copyrighted work:  This factor analyzes the degree to which the work that was used relates to copyright's purpose of encouraging creative expression. Thus, using a more creative or imaginative work (such as a novel, movie, or song) is less likely to support a claim of a fair use than using a factual work (such as a technical article or news item). In addition, use of an unpublished work is less likely to be considered fair. [ None of the characters on any franchise are currently in play. ][ We use a fair amount of copyrighted material, however, even the writers of Star Trek probably use Memory Alpha. Actually, I think even Simon Pegg asked the creators of Memory Alpha for help with a plot point in one of the Kelvinverse movies.
In addition to the above, other factors may also be considered by a court in weighing a fair use question, depending upon the circumstances. Courts evaluate fair use claims on a case-by-case basis, and the outcome of any given case depends on a fact-specific inquiry. This means that there is no formula to ensure that a predetermined percentage or amount of a work—or specific number of words, lines, pages, copies—may be used without permission. 

A lot of 'fair use' is a case by case basis, ultimately. I'm not privy to the board's budgeting but never in my life have I seen a play by post board's admin make a profit. This is about passion. Donations are the equivalent of everyone chipping in for gas on the way to a Star Trek convention. If CBS/Paramount goes after Play by Post (which is arguably fan fiction with original characters), then they're going to have crack down on fanfiction, which they're not willing to do. The bad publicity for stifling their fandoms, engaging in harmless activities that support their franchise is never going to be worth it to them.

Witches can be right, giants can be good. You decide what's right, you decide what's good. - No One Is Alone, Sondheim

 

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